Olympiacos Piraeus

[Faliro]

By the way, why is 90% (of course I'm exaggerating) Athens made of three storey flats on narrow streets?

Exactly. But not 3 story, 5 story maybe 6 or 7 also.

It is basically if Barcelona was built in 1970 instead of 1860 it would look like this.

people talk about communism. greece is communism. The whole city was demolished and built in one style, Bauhaus with greek balconies. the Greeks call this polykatikes. Literally 'levels.' the whole city is this 90%. All white. No other city on earth is uniformerly so similar architecturally. It is like being on a trip. Hundreds of flowers and plants from from the balconies... it is too weird.. but you know when u meet an athenian, he lives 90% chance in the same flat you do but with perhaps a slightly different dvd collection...

[jase25]

Really? I think we're getting worse.

In what sense? I recognize that much of the people who enroll in university these days are dumb and so on, but at least they have acess to some stuff their parents never dreamed of. Some of them get out of the university the same way they were before, true that. We are far from what I consider good, but at least that's something.

I'm not even talking about trying to create a true society of knowledge, a true democracy, where the average portuguese doesn't get driven by poor emotional judgements... we'll never get there. Or maybe in 2500.

I'm just saying we're more informed, and that can't be bad.

We're becoming less and less respectful to others,

We didn't deal that well with the change that this country suffered since the late 80's and early 90's,

We're more prone to corruption and "franciscleverness",

Luís Freitas Lobo,

etc. etc. etc.

Mostly true. I don't believe we're more prone to corruption. Fiscalization is improving. But far from good. Franciscleverness is a great term.

Also... we weren't ready to that economic boom of the 80's and 90's. Lack of education. And we'll do the same shit again when economy starts growing sometime in the future.

[PsychoFan]

Really? I think we're getting worse.

In what sense? I recognize that much of the people who enroll in university these days are dumb and so on, but at least they have acess to some stuff their parents never dreamed of. Some of them get out of the university the same way they were before, true that. We are far from what I consider good, but at least that's something.

I'm not even talking about trying to create a true society of knowledge, a true democracy, where the average portuguese doesn't get driven by poor emotional judgements... we'll never get there. Or maybe in 2500.

I'm just saying we're more informed, and that can't be bad.

We're becoming less and less respectful to others,

We didn't deal that well with the change that this country suffered since the late 80's and early 90's,

We're more prone to corruption and "franciscleverness",

Luís Freitas Lobo,

etc. etc. etc.

That lack of respect, it's not just a portuguese problem, it's worldwide problem. And that lack of respect it's not new, it's how humans are for thousands of years ffs. And the cause of that is the ego, the personality.

[jase25]

Really? I think we're getting worse.

In what sense? I recognize that much of the people who enroll in university these days are dumb and so on, but at least they have acess to some stuff their parents never dreamed of. Some of them get out of the university the same way they were before, true that. We are far from what I consider good, but at least that's something.

I'm not even talking about trying to create a true society of knowledge, a true democracy, where the average portuguese doesn't get driven by poor emotional judgements... we'll never get there. Or maybe in 2500.

I'm just saying we're more informed, and that can't be bad.

We're becoming less and less respectful to others,

We didn't deal that well with the change that this country suffered since the late 80's and early 90's,

We're more prone to corruption and "franciscleverness",

Luís Freitas Lobo,

etc. etc. etc.

That lack of respect, it's not just a portuguese problem, it's worldwide problem. And that lack of respect it's not new, it's how humans are for thousands of years ffs. And the cause of that is the ego, the personality.

Nope that's not the ego. The problem is the meaning anywone gives to the word freedom. Most people don't have respect for the other's freedom. If everyone had huge egos but a tremendous respect for the other's freedom we'd be allright. I can have a huge ego all for myself.

[HJDK]

I agree with Aka. Paradoxically we are getting worse. No one eager knowledge or culture anymore. Intellectuals nowadays are looked with disdain and are referred with a bad connotation. Everyday that passes seems to make the population dumber. Tricky, smart, "franciscleverness" people is what everyone enjoys. People don't even know "how to read" anymore, in any discussion it's either black or white, there's no truth in between.

[Aka]

The whole city was demolished

What exactly? Because as far as I know, Athens turned into a kinda small city under the Ottoman rule until 1834. What was built between 1834 and the time those buildings were made?

[Aka]

there's no truth in between.

Da tru?

[jase25]

I agree with Aka. Paradoxically we are getting worse. No one eager knowledge or culture anymore. Intellectuals nowadays are looked with disdain and are referred with a bad connotation. Everyday that passes seems to make the population dumber. Tricky, smart, "franciscleverness" people is what everyone enjoys. People don't even know "how to read" anymore, in any discussion it's either black or white, there's no truth in between.

Don't take me wrong, I agree completely with that. I just think we're a bit better. I would say that some time ago we were uninformed morons, and now we're more informed morons. And I'm not saying we're better informed. Just the normal stuff globalization has brought. People aren't completely clueless on some matters as they were some years ago.

All in all, I don't think the brain and mental process of the portuguese people has improved significantly.

[Aka]

No fundo, tornámo-nos nuns novos ricos parolos.

[PsychoFan]

Really? I think we're getting worse.

In what sense? I recognize that much of the people who enroll in university these days are dumb and so on, but at least they have acess to some stuff their parents never dreamed of. Some of them get out of the university the same way they were before, true that. We are far from what I consider good, but at least that's something.

I'm not even talking about trying to create a true society of knowledge, a true democracy, where the average portuguese doesn't get driven by poor emotional judgements... we'll never get there. Or maybe in 2500.

I'm just saying we're more informed, and that can't be bad.

We're becoming less and less respectful to others,

We didn't deal that well with the change that this country suffered since the late 80's and early 90's,

We're more prone to corruption and "franciscleverness",

Luís Freitas Lobo,

etc. etc. etc.

That lack of respect, it's not just a portuguese problem, it's worldwide problem. And that lack of respect it's not new, it's how humans are for thousands of years ffs. And the cause of that is the ego, the personality.

Nope that's not the ego. The problem is the meaning anywone gives to the word freedom. Most people don't have respect for the other's freedom. If everyone had huge egos but a tremendous respect for the other's freedom we'd be allright. I can have a huge ego all for myself.

Yes is the lack of freedom, equality. The no respect for what others live, say, whatever. An example of lack of equality: the judging, criticize a racist or a Nazi. Society and 99.99999% of people fully accept this, but a racist or a Nazi he no longer accepts.

But first what you understand by ego?

[HJDK]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyptNWBW_lY

"Morreu há pouco tempo"

[jase25]

People with self-confidence and who make their confidence be noted. People who are wrongly seen as arrogants. That was what I was talking about when mentioned ego-related stuff.

The problem is that common people are the true arrogants. Can't see shit beyond their own values and conceptions.

I believe that the future of humanity lies within one's self, through cultivating our interests and hobbies, sharing opinions with others and simply taking the most rational decisions.

[Aka]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyptNWBW_lY

"Morreu há pouco tempo"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyptNWBW_lY&t=1m39s

I still say it's Al Pacino.

[Faliro]

The whole city was demolished

What exactly? Because as far as I know, Athens turned into a kinda small city under the Ottoman rule until 1834. What was built between 1834 and the time those buildings were made?

Athens was mostly abandoned under the Ottomans. Most Greeks lived in the country side  of Greece or Istanbul and all over the aegean coast of Turkey. Plus the islands were full of greeks in those days before they all left to live in athens. When Athens became free, the Greeks built  a very pretty city there in the 1850s..























Some of this city remains around Plaka and around the central areas.

Athens stayed in great shape until WW2 when it was bombed and tanks made new roads around the city for fun...

Now the city received over 1 million immigrants from Turkey in 1922, with no housing for them. Therefore after the war, the place went crazy. Concrete... destruction of the past... very sad. There are still some areas that have old buildings, but most the place was rebuilt between the 1950s and 1980s. They just went crazy. Also the Junta allowed any building to be demolished. Now the city is this and it is a huge city. A monster. Piraeus once its own city, is now connected to it. They say 3.9 million. Bullshit. Closer to 4.7 million.

[PsychoFan]

People with self-confidence and who make their confidence be noted. People who are wrongly seen as arrogants. That was what I was talking about when mentioned ego-related stuff.

The problem is that common people are the true arrogants. Can't see shit beyond their own values and conceptions.

I believe that the future of humanity lies within one's self, through cultivating our interests and hobbies, sharing opinions with others and simply taking the most rational decisions.

Yes, that is what we can call the manifestations of the ego. That's what he wants, want's to be better than others, to be noticed and to be in control.

The problem is really ignorance, not of any knowledge of this world, but for who they really are. What are they , and where they came from. Or have you never asked yourself that?