Olympiacos Piraeus

[Faliro]

Barcelona don't have good attendances.

But Real Madrid does.
9k for Madrid and 5k for Barcelona.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_ACB_season#Attendances


Obviously I can't find stats for the greek league but based on the Euroleague stats, where Olympiacos is only slightly behind Real Madrid, they should be somewhere between the two.

I think some Olympiacos league games have very weak attendances from what I seen on Eurosport but that's obviously because the small greek clubs are way less attractive than the small spanish clubs.

But I honestly think every top european basketball team runs on the red. I think it's just not profitable at the moment.
The numbers for Barcelona, for example, are shocking:

In the last 21 years the Spanish basketball title has been won by clubs outside Madrid and Barcelona on only five occasions. Investment in both clubs' squads has been significant, with Barcelona Basquet, for instance, operating on a €28m budget last year despite just €4m in earnings.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/european/how-tax-break-gives-real-madrid-and-barcelona-an-unfair-edge-8749146.html

And we have to take into account that revenue from tv rights must be higher in Spain than in Greece.

Some very interesting points, I will do my best... for a sunday... 

Firstly this very useful article answers your question about the losses and I think it proves you correct - you can use google translate:

http://www.gazzetta.gr/stili/the-business-of-sports/article/587249/ta-oikonomika-megethi-ton-aionion-sto-mpasket

This is the actual financial sheet for Olympiacos BC in 2013 but it is in Greek...:
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=el&u=http://www.rebetition.gr/2014/09/2013_61.html&prev=search

Secondly,

PAO arena: 19,000 capacity
Real arena: 15,000 capacity
OSFP arena: 11,000 - 14,000 capacity
Barcelona arena: 7500 capacity

I could not find the attendances but I am sure they have got better since AEK returned to the top league. I suspect most attendances figures will be manipulated for tax reasons... and most the derby games will sell many tickets.

[T1n0_SLB]

The Basketball team is owned by the Angelopoulos brothers who are pharmaceutical magnates.

I don't think they make a loss but I am unsure as i don't follow the basketball team..

I haven't read about it but Madrid and Barcelona make huge losses and they have better average attendances.

True but Barcelona has many people with their fingers in the pie...who make money even if Barcelona loses money.. For a few reasons I find it a little difficult to believe the Angelopoulos brothers make a loss with the Basketball team. Maybe they do...

Savvidis... the retarded Greek Russian who owns PAOK acts like he has made a huge loss the last few years... but not sure how true it is... he buys exceptionally cheap players... if any and has fairly good attendances... I think the money he spent was on buying the club and building his small VIP section in the Toumba.. I think the rest of the club pays for itself... the pain in his shoe is the €30 - €40 million debt PAOK has from before he bought it. He has been negotiating unsuccessfully with the Greek Government to get the debt reduced since he bought PAOK.

PAO have about €30 million debt also, with no plan of removing it.

Olympiakos has 0 debt and made a fortune the last few years.

Here is the table for earnings only..

PAOK with  €40 million debt and PAO with 30? That's nothing.

We have €450 million and it cost us more than €20million/year.

[Faliro]

The problem for PAOK and PAO is that their revenues are tiny compared to Benfica...

Also their stadia are small and destroyed and their attendances nothing...

When PAO were playing in the OAKA last year.. they had to pay their games during daylight hours because they could not afford the electricity for the flood lights..

Finally PAOK and PAO can't sell big players... I believe you sold a 20 year old to Monaco to 15 million recently... PAO and PAOK have not sold one player in their history for that amount.

[T1n0_SLB]

Those earnigs are total or operational earnings?

I see €28 million for PAO two seasons ago, thats almost the same of their debt, our earnings are not close to our debt, it's about 1/3 of it.

[Faliro]

Those earnigs are total or operational earnings?

I see €28 million for PAO two seasons ago, thats almost the same of their debt, our earnings are not close to our debt, it's about 1/3 of it.

I believe the two columns are total revenue. It should be said that the owner of PAO is a lawyer with no big money. He say his job is simply to keep PAO alive....

[T1n0_SLB]

Ok, but €30 million debt is not that much.

Benfica
Operational revenues: €105.039 million
Transfer revenues: 75.576
Financial revenues: €4.086 million
Total revenues:       €184,7 million

Operational expenses : €109.156 million
Transfer expenses : €37.933 million
financial expenses : €23.705 million
Total expenses : €170.794 million

Operational result: -€4.117m
Transfer result: €37.643m
Financial reslults : -€19.619m
Net results: €14.2m


Debt:  €449,1million
Asset: €440,7million

[Faliro]

Yea, but from my table you can see, PAO's total revenue last year was only 18 million, I believe that is before outgoings... Benfica's total revenue was 184 million....

[T1n0_SLB]

Yet, bu their revenues ir more than half of thir debt and they can improve it

[Faliro]

Pereira is interested in the 24 year old winger of Guimaraes, Hernan.

[PsychoFan]

Pereira is interested in the 24 year old winger of Guimaraes, Hernan.

Individualistic, doesn't know shit about the game. Technically and physically very good. Here's Hernani.

[PsychoFan]

What about Neto, any news?

[Faliro]

Russians are playing hard ball and included him in a friendly match which means... it will difficult..

[iKatz]

Faliro 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyRX2ys2oNk

[HJDK]

Faliro 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OyRX2ys2oNk

Epá, parti a piça a rir logo com o 2º lance

[Blitzer]

Tyrnavos

Jara made is debut after coming on as a second-half substitute !