Hellas futebol

[Festivus]

Its tragic.

When you read about Perikles, you have a window into an human who wished beyond all things for the success of his city.

99% of politicians are corrupt, nasty and full of shit. What amazes me more than anything is people who vote them in each time.

The good news is many of the older generation are dying off. They were the ones who would vote and keep the system strong.

Every year less people vote... that is a good thing...

Isn't voting compulsory in Greece, though? What happens to those who abstain anyway? Do they get fined or something?

Here, abstention rates are usually pretty high.

[Faliro]

Not sure, I am not a greek citizen. 

I know in Brazil not voting is a big deal and must be done.

In the UK, hardly anyone votes anymore. It makes no difference if you do or don't both to you and the country.

In Greece most people vote for the party that promises the best state pension... Greek politicians are vile, just like English ones. Both sell out their country daily and despise the people they pretend to represent.

[Festivus]

Oh, so you weren't born in Greece?

People here usually end up voting for the same ones. It's like they don't learn from their mistakes. They just complain and then end up voting for the same parties and people. 

[Faliro]

My grandfather was Greek.

The rest is Catalan, Austrian, English.

The good news is that voting goes down each year. Each new generation trusts politicians less and votes less.

[mrkx]

What are the best prospects in the Greek league(ages 18-23)?

[Faliro]

Some exceptional ones imo:

Kostas Manolas - already discussed at length.

Fetfatzidis - already discussed at length.

Giannis Gianniotas - 21, very good attacking midfielder, controls the game, being wasted at Fortuna in Germany.

Stafylidis (Fulham) 20, incredible left back. Starter, exceptional strength, crossing, speed and goal scoring ability.

Andreas Bouxalakis (OSFP)  Huge talent, 21 years old, 6'1. Midfielder.

Goal yesterday against Milan- sensational: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-a2oh4be8Fg



Diamantakos (OSFP), 21 years old, 6'1, big future. Striker.



Nikos Vergos, 18 years old, 6'0 Striker - Great player already. (OSFP)

Kolovos 21 years old, 5'11 (OSFP) Attacking mid. Very clever and strong.

Dimitris Kourbelis, Asteras. defender, 20 years old, 6'0. Asteras are waiting to sell him for big money having turned down offers from the premiership last year.



Bakasetas. Asteras. Another player that will be big. He is also 21. 6'1.  Striker.

[mrkx]

Nice list. Vergos looks good and still so young, I guess he won't get much game time this year though? Olympiakos controls everything I see. Any standout players from the minor teams that will make a leap this year?

How is the economic situation at other clubes? Any light at the end of the tunnel for the rival teams? And about basketaball, are there still big budgets at greek teams? I assume Olympiakos is still strong(since they challenge in Europe), how about PAO and others?

How are the clubs funded, private money from their rich owners?

Cheers.

[Faliro]

I will answer the first last.

All clubs in Greece by law have to have an amateur element, however, no one really cares about this anymore. Every now and again and cheap owner will try and sell the fans shares in their own club to make some more money - like PAO. However the majority of clubs simply have a rich/semi rich owner. The exception is Aris which is owned by its fans.

Asteras is an interesting case. It seems the owners may use the club to clean money. The owner/s Bakos and friends, have spent a fortune since they came up, but is it their money? is it some arab behind the scenes? We may never know. One or two other clubs did have mafia style criminals running them. One such man is Big Mac, (Makis Psomiadis) who was a mafioso, owned night clubs - and was in charge of AEK and Kavala. He is in jail now.

The economic situation is bad in Greece among the majority of clubs, but in a positive way it has finally forced clubs to rely on their academies. No matter how shit the situation is, Greece has always produced excellent youth players, who would later become nothings thanks to the systems of hierarchy and experience being favoured over raw ability in Greece. However lately - the last year or so, we are seeing many youth players being allowed minutes the super league and they are thriving.

As for rival teams, PAO has little hope, it is controlled by man who doesn't undertand football and spends extremely little. AEK has light, if they get promoted this season. Their owner spends and has won the league before with them. He has a massive vision. Other clubs that I hope are promoted are Larissa and Aris. Both have good stadiums and fans. The problem has always been their propensity to select rubbish players.

Olympiakos and PAO Basketball teams are owned by exceptionally wealthy people. They will always spend big and be successful. The others have financial problems. PAOK however are trying to re-establish themselves as a big player. Most of the Greek Basketball talent emerges from the smaller teams who are actually quite good.

As for Vergos, he is a talent. We were down on strikers last year due to injury and we gave him some minutes in the league against Asteras. He had just turned 18. He scored almost immediately. He is definitely talented. The problem is, there are a few strikers ahead of him. Diamantikos, was already playing at Ergotelis last season, is older and will probably get a chance. Vergos will either be loaned (because the EPO still has not allowed B teams) or will continue in the youth team.

The reason Olympicos has the best youth is because we scout them from everywhere and have the best acadmies. If you look to where we got the players or where they were actually born, few are actually from anywhere near Piraeus:

Kostas Manolas -Born in Naxos. Came late to Olympiakos after playing for AEK.

Fetfatzidis - From Drama, northern Greece.

Andreas Bouxalakis From Crete.

Diamantakos from Piraeus.

Nikos Vergos, Kilkis, norther Greece.

etc..

Olympaicos simply takes the best players from everywhere/everyone else.

I cannot think of any other players of big talent besides two owned by PAOK, Koulouris (Striker, 18  - very talented - already better than anyother striker in the club with more goals to minutes than anyone else) and Stelios Kitsiou, right back and already a starter at 20.

It needs to be mentioned that it seems the majority of talented players seem to emerge from clubs such as Panionios. They allow their youth players to play whole seasons in the top league and as a result they simply produce a huge amount of talented players.

As for break out years. I think perhaps kourbelis of asteras and possibly Bakasetas of the same club. A lot depends on whether the clubs allow the youth to play or who they are loaned to. PAO sometimes lets their youth play, but the wrong ones... they let a player called Risvanis play 15 games for them last season and he was a disaster.

[mrkx]

Thanks for the comprehensive reply. Very interesting read.

It always fascinated me how Greece was so strong in basketball at club level, paying huge salaries and in football, while understanding that Olympiakos had some high paid players, they were never like a Galatasaray or a clube like that, that were splashing big money around. Basketball and football are independent from each other on the clubs management in Greece? Looking at the dreadful state of the football team of PAO and then seeing that they still have a good roster and a top coach in their basketball team, I assume that they're independent?

What is the balance of sports popularity in Greece. Basketball is that strong? It must hurt PAO fans that they are in such a sorry state, while in basketball they even managed to win the Euroleague two or three years ago.

I'll keep an eye out for those youngsters this season. If they get minutes, I'll try to watch some games.

Considering how dominant Olympiakos has been for so many years, shouldn't you have had more success in Europe? It must get boring to beat everyone in Greece and by midseason already having the league wrapped up.

[Faliro]

Thanks for the comprehensive reply. Very interesting read.

It always fascinated me how Greece was so strong in basketball at club level, paying huge salaries and in football, while understanding that Olympiakos had some high paid players, they were never like a Galatasaray or a clube like that, that were splashing big money around. Basketball and football are independent from each other on the clubs management in Greece?

Yes, the Basketball departments of Greek clubs are separate and unrelated financially.

Looking at the dreadful state of the football team of PAO and then seeing that they still have a good roster and a top coach in their basketball team, I assume that they're independent?

100% correct

It is owned by the Giannakopoulos family who are very wealthy. That is why they can buy big players. Their arena is one of the finest in Europe and their team is the most successful European basketball team only behind real Madrid .

What is the balance of sports popularity in Greece. Basketball is that strong? It must hurt PAO fans that they are in such a sorry state, while in basketball they even managed to win the Euroleague two or three years ago.

Can you believe when i was a kid basketball was the biggest sport in Greece? It only changed at the end of the 90's.

After the Greek national team won Euro basket in 87 I think it was, the Greek government was extremely clever (the only time in history). They forced every school in Greece to build a basketball court. That helped cement the sport in the minds of Greeks. Greeks make exceptionally good basketball players because of their size and strength and have always adored the sport. Towards the end of the 90's football became the dominant sport in Greece, but basketball holds almost a mystical place in the Greek mind. Greeks are also fascinated with the NBA.

As for PAO fans being hurt. They are emotionally and psychologically scared at how shit they have been the last decades.  All this however has been from lack of investment. The one year they spent more than Olympiakos on players (bought players like Cisse etc..) - they won the league easily.

Considering how dominant Olympiakos has been for so many years, shouldn't you have had more success in Europe? It must get boring to beat everyone in Greece and by midseason already having the league wrapped up.

The problem was the competition was so weak. Olympiakos would spend between 10 - 30 million on players, PAO and AEK - 7 million combined... Beating the league was simple, Europe was hard.  However for me the biggest damage was that Olympiakos always found itself in the CL. I believe if we had always been only in the europa we may... have made a final by now.

Are you an agent?

[Faliro]

Tomorrow, perhaps the biggest vote in parliament in years concerning Greek football.

It is the vote for the law allowing AEK to rebuild their stadium/ Articles 81 and 82 of the bill for the new master plan Attica.

The communists who have sought to block the project from day one came out with some classic lines today - 'we do not accept lessons in patriotism' - no shit... 'there is no difference btween 27,000 seats and 33,000'

ANEL party (right wing) declaration summarized, hilarious. ''There is AEK is AEKara. AEK are entitled stadium. The Government is not entitled to have them split up in New Philadelphia. SYRIZA (communists) albeit with vazelo president ruined the stadium project  of PAO in Votanikos. And so was the Leoforos ruined. Leveled Votanikos for the mosque however and they have no complaints and block nothing!! Tomorrow we will tell you more about the stadium of AEK. Just think about why we do not like direct democracy? Referendum. The AEK must obtain Stadium. Like PAO. Modern stadiums, as Olympiacos'.

oh alas, what a dream could Hellas have been without pseudo communism...

[Faliro]

Elder Barbosa to AEK.

[H]

Elder Barbosa to AEK.

Used to be a promising player. Yet, it didn't turn out to be anything else... just a promise.

[Faliro]

should find the second division in Greece easy.

[brankinho_gaspar]

Yeah, he deserved better. He's a first division player.